Our coyote build thread.

[staying_tuned]

These guys have thought of everything for the average wrench turner IMO. I’m sure the Vortech install steps are just about as "basic" as the Whipple is

It really is shocking how turnkey these kits are, the coyote is such a stout yet friendly motor. Terry mentioned the install time is near identical to the Whipple!

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[staying_tuned]

She's coming along. So far fitment is spot-on. It's going to have to sit for a few days but I should be able to wrap it up later this week, possibly into the weekend.

 

[TexasTruck]

Fortunately it sounds like you can take your time, step by step, that’s great you can think through the process. Keep us posted!

 

[staying_tuned]

Post Vortech install video up, posted it here on the Vortech thread.

 

[zimmer0]

@TexasTruck that is the beauty of a belt driven twin screw blower, the power comes on when you actually want it. It’s also the most consistent power adder, almost like adding cubic inches. It’s always there, every time, and the same way. No funny business trying to build boost etc, no botched runs. It’s just there.

For racing the Vortech is more “lead foot friendly”, hence the statement about not having to worry about throttle modulation. Centris have gained a lot of traction (no pun intended) over the past decade or more due to being easier to race. Boost builds with RPM on a center vs always having max boost with a twin screw, if memory serves me correctly anyways

apologies for my ignorance, would the vortech/centrifugal setup make it more economical over a twin screw/whipple due to the RPM based boost? Always was intrigued by forced induction but didn't want to sacrifice too much mpg/DD duty by adding it.

 

[staying_tuned]

apologies for my ignorance, would the vortech/centrifugal setup make it more economical over a twin screw/whipple due to the RPM based boost? Always was intrigued by forced induction but didn't want to sacrifice too much mpg/DD duty by adding it.

It's almost certainly getting better MPG vs. a PD Whipple or Rousch but I'm also leaving power on the table when the RPMs are low. For me this wasn't a concern given the 10-speed. It is all-but dormant when I'm just fiddling around or with the family. IATs, trans temps, MPGs etc. are near stock-like when the RPMs are low with these centris. That all changes past 3k RPM and with the 10-speed I'm over 3k RPM anytime I want to hoon on it. A centri can cover more ground top-end with (on average) higher HP given the same amount of boost but it isn't linear, it acts more like a turbo in that sense. It recovers faster, quite a bit faster. Heat is far less of an issue but again you're leaving power on the table until you're high in the RPM band.

FWIW I wouldn't want to challenge a stock otherwise whipple 4x4 truck with my stock otherwise vortech 4x4 truck from a dig but would happily from a roll.

 

[JExpedition07]

apologies for my ignorance, would the vortech/centrifugal setup make it more economical over a twin screw/whipple due to the RPM based boost? Always was intrigued by forced induction but didn't want to sacrifice too much mpg/DD duty by adding it.

A belt driven blower has more parasitic losses since its belt driven off the crankshaft, so it’s less fuel efficient. But being driven by the crankshaft there is no lag or delay. A centrifugal generally has lag, you can mitigate this with a smaller turbine that spools faster, but that gives up your top end potential. The 3.5 EcoBoost dies off and doesn’t breath after 5,500 rpm no matter what you do unless you replace those turbos, but then you give up its low end torque if you swap them out. A blower can do both a little easier. That’s why Ford has pretty much went back to blowers on all the performance vehicles. The exhaust note also plays into it, a whipple is not chopping up your exhaust note.

I would have a hard time deciding which way to go. I like that with the Vortech kit you can keep your stock intake manifold and keep cooling cores off the top of the engine. It’s a clean look.

 

[staying_tuned]

A belt driven blower has more parasitic losses since its belt driven off the crankshaft, so it’s less fuel efficient.

Great point, my understanding was that the parasitic loss driving the head unit has less of a negative impact on MPG than the additional fuel demanded throughout the entire RPM band in the case of a positive displacement unit. I reset my MPG and currently I'm sitting at 15.4. That's about 2 MPG lower than my average but I have been hooning on it and logging pulls. I know our meters can't really be trusted though so who knows. We've got a trip out west planned early summer, it will be interesting to see where it averages out.

 

[bfastr]

something about a blower. timeless cool factor.

 

[HammaMan]

Given the 10 speeds weaknesses, I'd run with centrifugal -- plus the 10 speed's advantage in that you're never below 4k RPM once you leave first (the weakness is my biggest fear in my truck having 700ftlbs of torque, easily spinning all 4 34" LT tires on launch). All of the positive displacement blowers heat soak much easier. Lots of mass sitting on top of the block. They also use air-water-air cooling which is less efficient than air/air. One benefit of air-water-air is that you can hijack the water supply with ice if you have a large enough reservoir. That's really only good for drag racing though and isn't practical on the street.

Ford did a neat trick for the time with a prototype lightning in that they tapped the AC system to drastically cool down the water tank essentially giving you a nice little power boost (up to 60hp) allowing for cool dense air getting fed directly into the engine. The powerboost uses this technique to cool down its high voltage cooling loop which essentially turns the AC system into a dual zone mini split.

Positive displacement does have a slight disadvantage in parasitic drag due to the mass of the rotors as well as the drag associated with rotor meshing. It does have the benefit of being a tighter / cleaner package though. Turbos are easily the 'messiest' in terms of their additional plumbing while having the benefit of the least parasitic, but they also have high under-hood temps due to higher EGTs increasing the heat of the exhaust manifold, also adding the turbine housing and down pipe as additional heat sources. They also increase engine oil temps and the demand placed on the radiator. It's just heat heat heat all the way around.

A centrifugal blower can use a smaller pulley to drive it faster while using a boost controller to limit pressure so that more power is made sooner while limiting upper boost pressure. It just dumps the additional air 'overboard' through a BOV.

A generic representation of each method's torque curve

Boost pressures of 2 positive displacement blowers v Turbo v Centrifugal SC

Sound wise I think the centrifugal blowers are hard to beat. Loved the sound of my procharger. Though a screaming turbo sounding like a little jet engine is hard to not like as well.

 

[TexasTruck]

Apologies for my ignorance, would the vortech/centrifugal setup make it more economical over a twin screw/whipple due to the RPM based boost?

What every one said above about a PD vs centrifugal is on point and jives with the research prior to my FP Whipple decision. However, in terms of MPG, my average MPG is exactly the same - no BS… hand calculated. I was/am consistently averaging 16.4 NA and now SC, mixed use (flat, inclines, stop and go, etc). I just drive normal, average 2/2.5K RPM acceleration, cruise around, no Hypermiling crap, I just drive it. I have driven on the highway to the airport and what have you and see 18.7 on that 80 mile round trip. I have stock sized tires, 20x9 wheels and a leveling kit - go figure.

That said, I am quite certain if I jab at the throttle all the time and drive it like no one's looking that will change. Perhaps my intensions are different than most I guess.....

 

[TexasTruck]

Always was intrigued by forced induction but didn't want to sacrifice too much mpg/DD duty by adding it.

Me too! I'm old and figure before I kick it I'm going to do it. I have some regrets thanks to the internet, but I did it and can reverse it in a few hours if I get cold feet.

I like that with the Vortech kit you can keep your stock intake manifold and keep cooling cores off the top of the engine.

This is a big plus IMO and bothers me too. There has only been one occurrence of a heat exchanger leak that I'm aware of. That was on an early release Whipple Gen 5 3.0 kit that Backroad Drivers had. Since then, Whipple now pressure tests the heat exchanger. Better than nothing I suppose, but still....

 

[staying_tuned]

Had a dyno session this morning. Numbers are low at 469/442 at the wheel but the runs were extremely consistent and it sounded healthy. This is 5th gear on up to 7k on the standard pulley, 3.73 rear. Picked up a good bit from average DJ stock runs but I'm hoping we can pull another 80-90 out of it while still on this mild base pulley, plenty of headroom from a fueling perspective. I was able to log and have sent them off to Josh at 5 Star.

 

[staying_tuned]

Got the Corsa Sport Mid-Exit (before the tire) mounted. Packaging & quality is fantastic, fitment is dead-on and it sounds great. I've just installed it today but was able to cruise on up through 90 and zero drone. This is my first Corsa exhaust, I suspected the zero-drone reviews were exaggerated. I'm shocked that as loud as it is when getting on the throttle, it yields zero detectable drone, not even the slightest of humming.

The black tip finish option looks sharp. Not sure if it will help but I hit them with a coat of ceramic before mounting.

 

[joelle king]

Great build !

Kodi​

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