Ford Warns Dealers Against Additional Deposit / Payment Requirements For Lightning Orders. Supports No-Resale Provisions in Purchase Contracts

[Clickbeast]

Oof. I understand and will cede the point no problem. I was just pointing out that from my view point of being on the fence trying to decide what I wanted and watching it go up was as much of a turn off for me as a dealer experience. That’s all fella.

Sorry, I shouldn't have said it rudely like that - I think I've read too many /r/askcarsales threads where that argument comes up.

I 100% agree that the price hikes for those that didn't order, especially so many so quickly, does sour the experience. I had debated buying a Model Y a year ago to compliment the 3, but walked away after seeing the $8k delta - you're right, it does suck!

Sponsored

 

[Viper GTS]

I'm trying to understand why one document says (I'm paraphrasing) "Dealers, stop damaging our reputation by screwing customers with markups" and also includes "Customers, you can't resell the lightning". Are these things related?

To me, the reason that a dealer shouldn't mark up this car is that they didn't sell it to me. I researched, selected it and ordered it through Ford and am willing to pay the Ford price. The dealership added no value but I guess they have to be part of the sales process due to the dealership/manufacturer structure. Perhaps a straight fee for their time?

But I'm still trying to understand why Ford would support limiting the customer's ability to sell the car. Who benefits from that?

IMO everyone benefits from it except someone who was trying to be a scalper.

Ford benefits because they want to have vehicles sold for MSRP even when they have a popular product with limited supply. If Ford could make more Lightnings they would, it's bad for their relationship with the public if the vehicles aren't available without massive markup or available only on the scalper market.

Dealers benefit because they no longer feel like they're giving up potential profit to asshole buyers. From the dealership's perspective if there is a wild imbalance between vehicle demand and supply someone is bound to exploit it. If it's not them, then it's likely to be the person they sell to. Why should the dealer play nice if the customers are then free to capitalize on it? If they are freed from the temptation of charging big ADM and sell only to customers who actually want to own the vehicle they get to build long term relationships with their customers and sell them a dozen vehicles over their lifetime instead of possibly just one.

People who actually want to buy and use vehicles benefit because they get the chance to purchase a vehicle at the manufacturer's suggested price. Also, with the scalpers gone they might actually stand a chance of getting one.

Scalpers nobody gives a shit about. Screw them.

 

[khatch]

IMO everyone benefits from it except someone who was trying to be a scalper.

Ford benefits because they want to have vehicles sold for MSRP even when they have a popular product with limited supply. If Ford could make more Lightnings they would, it's bad for their relationship with the public if the vehicles aren't available without massive markup or available only on the scalper market.

Dealers benefit because they no longer feel like they're giving up potential profit to asshole buyers. From the dealership's perspective if there is a wild imbalance between vehicle demand and supply someone is bound to exploit it. If it's not them, then it's likely to be the person they sell to. Why should the dealer play nice if the customers are then free to capitalize on it? If they are freed from the temptation of charging big ADM and sell only to customers who actually want to own the vehicle they get to build long term relationships with their customers and sell them a dozen vehicles over their lifetime instead of possibly just one.

People who actually want to buy and use vehicles benefit because they get the chance to purchase a vehicle at the manufacturer's suggested price. Also, with the scalpers gone they might actually stand a chance of getting one.

Scalpers nobody gives a shit about. Screw them.

That makes sense. Thanks.

 

[PungoteagueDave]

Imagine if you had to spend hours at multiple dealers negotiating with salespeople before you could get the out-the-door price. Even if you were satisfied with the price, how do you know you couldn't have gotten a better price at the dealer a few miles down the road?

With Tesla and Rivian, it takes less than 60 seconds to discover your price and it's locked in when you place the order. If the price goes down, you can just cancel and reorder. If the price goes up, they're still going to honor the original terms.

Nope, Tesla now has a nonrefundable order fee - it is no longer a deposit. And Tesla has been jerking people around who had orders, but then Tesla updated the model, cancelled the order and the update cost $10k or more over the prior version. Tesla has been ALL over the place on pricing - arbitrary, not based on cost, but based on what they can get, status of tax credit availability, etc. I've had four so far, love the cars, but the buying experience has been terrible, far worse than any of the dozens of other cars I've purchased new over the years, including numerous Ford products.

 

[adoublee]

Nope, Tesla now has a nonrefundable order fee - it is no longer a deposit. And Tesla has been jerking people around who had orders, but then Tesla updated the model, cancelled the order and the update cost $10k or more over the prior version. Tesla has been ALL over the place on pricing - arbitrary, not based on cost, but based on what they can get, status of tax credit availability, etc. I've had four so far, love the cars, but the buying experience has been terrible, far worse than any of the dozens of other cars I've purchased new over the years, including numerous Ford products.

How about when they doubled/tripled cost of solar shingle roofs for people WITH CONTRACTS. It amazes me how people think if they had a good order experience with them that suddenly dealerships should completely shrivel up and die. They should both just strive to do better.

 

[RavenYZF-R6]

Sorry, I shouldn't have said it rudely like that - I think I've read too many /r/askcarsales threads where that argument comes up.

I 100% agree that the price hikes for those that didn't order, especially so many so quickly, does sour the experience. I had debated buying a Model Y a year ago to compliment the 3, but walked away after seeing the $8k delta - you're right, it does suck!

It my own fault really for being undecided if I wanted to spend that much and then thinking the BBB might pass and allow them a credit and then them increasing the price thinking the same lol. By the time I could have ordered the price went up enough to eat up any tax credit anyway ?.

 

[FordLightning]

I'm trying to understand why one document says (I'm paraphrasing) "Dealers, stop damaging our reputation by screwing customers with markups" and also includes "Customers, you can't resell the lightning". Are these things related?

To me, the reason that a dealer shouldn't mark up this car is that they didn't sell it to me. I researched, selected it and ordered it through Ford and am willing to pay the Ford price. The dealership added no value but I guess they have to be part of the sales process due to the dealership/manufacturer structure. Perhaps a straight fee for their time?

But I'm still trying to understand why Ford would support limiting the customer's ability to sell the car. Who benefits from that?

I am OK with both provisions. Dealers and consumers can act badly.

I don’t want a dealer raising the price to earn a priority and I don’t want people who are not interested in a vehicle buying it, just so they can screw someone else worse than a dealer. It minimizes scalping.

 

[AgieF150]

Very glad to see them nip the extra reservation fees in the bud. I like the idea behind the no resale provision, but a year seems a little harsh. If you hate the car or for some financial reason need to get rid of it, you shouldn’t have to fight some contract. Maybe trading it back in to a dealer would be okay.

i bought a Mach-E couple weeks ago but want to upgrade my trim, ford dealer is offering 14k less then online resale dealers, how is this fair to customer If they add 1 yr no sale stipulation?

 

[AgieF150]

This happens. I know of a Cadillac dealer who (to avoid charging ADM on a new vehicle) would sell a new Escalade to someone who didn’t want it for MSRP, then immediately buy it back for an extra $1000. Said dealer would then sell the “used” Escalade for 10K or more over MSRP. F’N crazy!

I saw 5 Mercedes GLS Maybach at one dealership, with 100k markup When most MB dealership can not get their hand on a single Maybach edition vehicle.

 

[Royalist]

Could be an issue for reselling too, no sale provision.

 

[Whiskey]

This no resale provision on a production vehicle is complete overreach. I’d be surprised if it’s enforceable. The GT is a different animal with the very limited production.

You’re kidding Right? This is FORDS product, they spent the time and money developing it. The only people that should profit is Ford, not the dealerships and definitely not the public. Buy the truck if you want to enjoy the ride but don’t buy it to profit off Fords hard work.

 

[Whiskey]

This does nothing to stop dealerships from gouging the consumer
ADM are still allowed
just no extra deposit and you cannot sell your truck for a year

How do you figure that won’t stop the dealership ADM?? If ya ain’t got the truck to sell ya can’t mark it up? And it’s Ford product to profit from, not mine, not yours or anybody else. Don’t buy it if you don’t want to ride it!

 

[Sdctcher]

I would only accept the No Resale if it were tied to No ADM. I would not sign if the dealer was going ahead and also charging any ADM.

Also, Ford has done this before with the GT and sued John Cena (settled out of court).

There would have to be some loopholes such as my selling with hardship or transfer to family members or via a trust.

There is talk of tying the Tax Credit to a one or two year No Sale Clause.

 

[broncoaz]

I would only accept the No Resale if it were tied to No ADM. I would not sign if the dealer was going ahead and also charging any ADM.

Also, Ford has done this before with the GT and sued John Cena (settled out of court).

There would have to be some loopholes such as my selling with hardship or transfer to family members or via a trust.

There is talk of tying the Tax Credit to a one or two year No Sale Clause.

I would be ok with tying the tax credit to a one year no sale clause. Easy to do, just make it so one could only collect if they still own the vehicle in the subsequent tax year, delaying the tex credit to year 2.

 

[Clickbeast]

Image removed by Ford's request hahaha

It's already hosted by literally every other media site out there, now this forum goes from "1st place it was posted" to "the only place it's not posted"

Sponsored