Catch can information - Dual injection test for Carbon build up in 3.5L PowerBoost engine

[dirty.hal]

Instead of messing around with a catch can couldn't you just get the motor walnut blasted every 150k or so?

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[Gros Ventre]

Instead of messing around with a catch can couldn't you just get the motor walnut blasted every 150k or so?

Well... If the catchcan extands that to 300K maybe its worth doing... And don't forget that the oily gunk spreads throughout your intake system not just on the valves...

 

[spiritrider1]

How does it violate emissions?
The air flow goes back into the manifold, after passing thru the can, is the fact that later the oil collected needs to be properly disposed of?

I was going to say the same thing. This is just basically an air filter for the blow-by oil. As for the waste oil, just dump it in with the old oil during a change. If you need to empty between changes, just keep a quart bottle for dumping into.

 

[spiritrider1]

I ran catch cans (RX) on 3 of my past f-150 eco boosts until finally my dealer threatened to void my warranty, I guess it’s a violation of federal emissions , as pcv is a emission piece, I haven’t put one on my 21 (yet)

The PCV stays on the valve cover. It is not removed. All you are doing is running the air through an air-oil separating device and back into the crankcase. The tube you remove is just that - a tube. It's replaced with two tubes and the can in between. Nothing is being vented to atmosphere.

Some (not all) Dealership Service departments pontificate and bloviate to sound impressive and threatening, as if they know more than they really do. A Jeep dealer tried to do that to me a few years ago when their new (at the time) Wrangler JL had tons of front tracking and shimmying issues. I took it in several times for the same thing and they wanted to blame it on the 2" lift that 'voided' the warranty. I pointed out half their lot was filled with 'modified' Wranglers. I asked if they were selling them new without warranty?? Answer: Dealer installed. It's all about $$$'s.
BTW - they soon after came out with a 'quiet' technical bulletin to recall a slew of steering dampers due to the front shimmy issue. I had fixed it myself with my own suspension upgrades and a quality stabilizer. I fought FCA and finally got them to pay me for the cost the stabilizer.

Dealers want to avoid having to mess with a vehicle that may have modifications since it may take a more time than the fixed price allows. They can't recoup the cost through warranty. Dealers don't automatically get paid by the manufacturer. They have to justify the labor and each task has fixed labor hours. So if you had a vacuum leak and it was found to be a loose hose clamp on the catch can, they will not get paid warranty labor. Although, they would have probably passed that on to the customer at billing since the diagnosis found it to be a part not installed in production.

 

[XLT22]

J&L 3.0 has a multi layer screen/filter that makes the vapors pool into droplets.

Not even close to the same thing. Notice they call it a “separator” instead of a crankcase filter. If running it makes you feel better that’s fine, but don’t expect it to really make much difference.

This is more in line with what I’m referring to. Still unneeded on an engine that sees regular maintenance but does what it says.

https://www.republic-mfg.com/filters/3931070550.asp

 

[trojandawg3]

Not even close to the same thing. Notice they call it a “separator” instead of a crankcase filter. If running it makes you feel better that’s fine, but don’t expect it to really make much difference.

This is more in line with what I’m referring to. Still unneeded on an engine that sees regular maintenance but does what it says.

https://www.republic-mfg.com/filters/3931070550.asp

Serious question....what regular maintenance makes the catch can unnecessary? I don't have one on my truck but have been considering it.

 

[erixgix]

It’s an interesting accessory. While technically able to say it filters, it isn’t one in the conventional sense some might assume with limited detail provided. Its a deposition filter similar to the grease filter in a kitchen range hood. They added the honeycomb to increase the surface are for deposition probably because the ‘filter’ wasn’t effective enough.

Even if not 100% removed, safe to say it works and any bit you can take out is a good thing. My only reservation is justifying the price point with them selling the 2x capacity can for ‘only’ $40 implying the margin on the $160 kit is pretty high.

I know, I know…but the truck was $70k + so it’s nothing lol. It reminds me of those that put down adding the digital hvac at $300 and all the rational why digital was dumb, and then many of them ran out and bought them when it dropped to $100. I need this thing to be $99 to start seeing that oil in the wee can as my 3.5 getting huge gobs of oil thrown at it under boost vs how little it is in reality if you’re only atomizing a single ounce over 1,000 miles with the major being burned.

 

[trojandawg3]

I am just wondering why something so simple and relatively inexpensive would not be added by Ford if even remotely necessary...

 

[XLT22]

Serious question....what regular maintenance makes the catch can unnecessary? I don't have one on my truck but have been considering it.

Just change the oil at or before the IOLM tells you. That’s literally it. Any API SP oil, or even better Dexos 1, Gen 3 oils are formulated to help prevent intake deposits. I’ve seen too many Ford and GM engines with the top end removed at well over 100k miles that had nothing more than a light varnish on the throttle body and intake ports while being completely sludged up otherwise. Ford recommended spec oil is fine but the GM Dexos spec is widely considered the top of the heap for domestics.

 

[Gutshot]

Not even close to the same thing. Notice they call it a “separator” instead of a crankcase filter. If running it makes you feel better that’s fine, but don’t expect it to really make much difference.

This is more in line with what I’m referring to. Still unneeded on an engine that sees regular maintenance but does what it says.

https://www.republic-mfg.com/filters/3931070550.asp

I don’t even have 100 miles on the catch can yet, but, if my results are similar to the results of others posted on here, and other sites, I’ll consider it useful for the life of my vehicle, as I intend to keep this truck.

 

[trojandawg3]

Just change the oil at or before the IOLM tells you. That’s literally it. Any API SP oil, or even better Dexos 1, Gen 3 oils are formulated to help prevent intake deposits. I’ve seen too many Ford and GM engines with the top end removed at well over 100k miles that had nothing more than a light varnish on the throttle body and intake ports while being completely sludged up otherwise. Ford recommended spec oil is fine but the GM Dexos spec is widely considered the top of the heap for domestics.

Well, I'm going way overkill on the oil changes.....full synthetic every 3300ish miles.

 

[pavementends]

Just change the oil at or before the IOLM tells you. That’s literally it. Any API SP oil, or even better Dexos 1, Gen 3 oils are formulated to help prevent intake deposits. I’ve seen too many Ford and GM engines with the top end removed at well over 100k miles that had nothing more than a light varnish on the throttle body and intake ports while being completely sludged up otherwise. Ford recommended spec oil is fine but the GM Dexos spec is widely considered the top of the heap for domestics.

So are you saying that "worn out" oil, or oil used too long, actually causes more build up that a catch can will... catch? Is the shearing of molecules that makes it thinner and therefor more susceptible to vaporizing? Oil change at or before this molecular breakdown negates a catch can?

 

[Calson]

Bottomline a catch can device makes sense on the older engines but no sense at all on the new version of the 3.5L. Better to change your oil more often if you think that there might be a problem and prevent issues with moisture when burning E85 fuel as well.

 

[XLT22]

So are you saying that "worn out" oil, or oil used too long, actually causes more build up that a catch can will... catch? Is the shearing of molecules that makes it thinner and therefor more susceptible to vaporizing? Oil change at or before this molecular breakdown negates a catch can?

I’m referring to engines so poorly maintained they had cam phaser issues from lack of oil changes, but were not appreciably dirtier on the intake tract than a properly maintained engine.

The oil gets dirty from byproducts of combustion, fuel dilution and oxidation. The only real harm that can come with a catch can is freezing of the lines in cold weather if you idle excessively. That tends to happen more on the diesel side of things but can happen on a gasoline engine too. It certainly won’t make the engine run any worse, just remember to empty it and be happy it’s trapping at least a small amount of “oil.”

 

[Timtoolman]

The PCV stays on the valve cover. It is not removed. All you are doing is running the air through an air-oil separating device and back into the crankcase. The tube you remove is just that - a tube. It's replaced with two tubes and the can in between. Nothing is being vented to atmosphere.

Some (not all) Dealership Service departments pontificate and bloviate to sound impressive and threatening, as if they know more than they really do. A Jeep dealer tried to do that to me a few years ago when their new (at the time) Wrangler JL had tons of front tracking and shimmying issues. I took it in several times for the same thing and they wanted to blame it on the 2" lift that 'voided' the warranty. I pointed out half their lot was filled with 'modified' Wranglers. I asked if they were selling them new without warranty?? Answer: Dealer installed. It's all about $$$'s.
BTW - they soon after came out with a 'quiet' technical bulletin to recall a slew of steering dampers due to the front shimmy issue. I had fixed it myself with my own suspension upgrades and a quality stabilizer. I fought FCA and finally got them to pay me for the cost the stabilizer.

Dealers want to avoid having to mess with a vehicle that may have modifications since it may take a more time than the fixed price allows. They can't recoup the cost through warranty. Dealers don't automatically get paid by the manufacturer. They have to justify the labor and each task has fixed labor hours. So if you had a vacuum leak and it was found to be a loose hose clamp on the catch can, they will not get paid warranty labor. Although, they would have probably passed that on to the customer at billing since the diagnosis found it to be a part not installed in production.

Just relaying what ford dealer said, and dealer was correct , catch can is a emission modification , pretty simple, and against federal law if it gets pushed far enough , ( especially theses days ) , emission laws are getting more enforced these days , diesel brothers engines? Harley screaming eagle tuners ? To name a few , they violated emissions laws , just saying , I still have my catch can , just being careful with it

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