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Belt driven oil pumps. Just 5.0 and 2.7?

Sneezy

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I’m curious if my 3.3N/A has a belt driven pump? I just got done watching a video on YouTube where the ‘wet belt’ grenaded on a 1.0 EcoBoost that was presumed to be low-ish mileage and Fords ‘wet belt’ system doesn’t look too confidence inspiring. I know the 5.0’s have them and the 2.7’s made the switch as well, I wonder if the entire lineup has moved over

I’d like to be proactive on swapping it out on my 3.3 if I do indeed have one


The video is long, but he starts the belt inspection/disassembly around the 13:00 mark

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Buyer2021

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I’m curious if my 3.3N/A has a belt driven pump?
Another excuse for a bit of quick fun research / learning something new today (y) :)

Taking a look at the 2022 F150 Workshop Manual, 3.3L engine General Overview section, we see yours is driven directly off the crankshaft:

Oil Pump
......
Generically, this design is known as a gerotor pump, which operates as follows:
  • The oil pump is mounted on the front face of the cylinder block.
  • The inner rotor is piloted on the crankshaft post and is driven through flats on the crankshaft
  • .......
BTW, my 3.5EB is the same ;)

Yes, the 2.7 and 5.0 run off a belt :unsure: (no idea if that's proven problematic?)

Lots of engines have been running a long time with 'wet belts' for various systems including OHC drives (e.g. my former 2014 Escape 2.0EB 4-cylinder), many of those proving very robust. 'Wet belts' aren't unique to Ford by any means (Ford was not the initial developer of 'wet belts').
 
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Sneezy

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Another excuse for a bit of quick fun research / learning something new today (y) :)

Taking a look at the 2022 F150 Workshop Manual, 3.3L engine General Overview section, we see yours is driven directly off the crankshaft:

Oil Pump
......
Generically, this design is known as a gerotor pump, which operates as follows:
  • The oil pump is mounted on the front face of the cylinder block.
  • The inner rotor is piloted on the crankshaft post and is driven through flats on the crankshaft
  • .......
BTW, my 3.5EB is the same ;)

Yes, the 2.7 and 5.0 run off a belt :unsure: (no idea if that's proven problematic?)

Lots of engines have been running a long time with 'wet belts' for various systems including OHC drives (e.g. my former 2014 Escape 2.0EB 4-cylinder), many of those proving very robust. 'Wet belts' aren't unique to Ford by any means (Ford was not the initial developer of 'wet belts').
You’re awesome!!! Thank you for looking that up for me, google wasn’t much help.

Yeah I figured they have been out in F150’s for several years now and there are no known failures. If any application is going to be tough on components it’s pickup trucks out doing work, but it’s good to know that the 3.5 and 3.3 don’t have them. I wonder what made them switch on the 2.7, since they are in the same engine family (I believe)

Thanks again for looking that up in the workshop manual for me 👍🏻
 

Tomatoboy

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You’re awesome!!! Thank you for looking that up for me, google wasn’t much help.

Yeah I figured they have been out in F150’s for several years now and there are no known failures. If any application is going to be tough on components it’s pickup trucks out doing work, but it’s good to know that the 3.5 and 3.3 don’t have them. I wonder what made them switch on the 2.7, since they are in the same engine family (I believe)

Thanks again for looking that up in the workshop manual for me 👍🏻
Despite the EcoBoost branding, the 2.7 is not in the same family.

The 2.7 is part of the “Nano” family of engines (comprised of the 2.7 1st and 2nd generations, and the current 3.0 EcoBoost). It was a clean sheet design with a somewhat unconventional two-piece compacted-graphite-iron block and a die-cast aluminum ladder frame.

The 3.3 N/A and 3.5 EcoBoost were outgrowths of the older 3.5 “Cyclone” engine family (originally marketed as one of the Duratec engines. Ford’s engine branding is really messy compared to their actual engine families) that have been revised a few times now.

The two families don’t really share any significant parts.

Regardless, a similar change has occurred with some other engines adopting the variable pumps, so it’s been speculated there’s some relationship, but I’ve never seen a solid answer why Ford made the change. What we also haven’t seen is any evidence of widespread issues related to these pumps or how they’re driven. But to answer your original question, on the F-150 the only engines using it are the 2.7 and 5.0 as of today. Other engines use it outside of the F-150 line.
 
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Mosey

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OP, please keep in mind I Do Cars tears down bad engines. I am not saying there may be an issue, just you cannot infer an issue without a lot more hard data. Also, the 3.0 Liter Duramax uses a wet belt too.
 

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boo radley

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Screw belts.

I've never owned a timing belt engine. When I learned of the 5.0 oil pump belt that eliminated that engine for me.
 

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The Kevlar belt in the 2021+ 5.0L is significantly stronger than the old cast gerator gears in the previous crank driven oil pump. Fords engineers stated the Kevlar belt is good for 1,100 horsepower per their torture testing, the old cast gears shattered and blew apart at a much lower rpm than the Kevlar belt is capable of in their testing. If you like a weaker/inferior oil pump design I guess cast gears driven driven off the crank in gerator are for you. A wet Kevlar drive belt is not a general wear item.

Ford raised the redline significantly on the 2021+ 5.0L engine to 6,700 rpm with the intent of making an engine from the factory supercharger capable. They needed a stronger oil pump solution than the old gerator pump that was cost effective and able to rev higher. They also upgraded the pistons, piston rings, and connecting rods. Now they just came out with the 700 horsepower supercharger package with a factory warranty.
 
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WhiteLightningnshitshadow

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I have a real hard time believing it won't degrade in a bath of engine oil and detergents/solvents over years of use. Anyone want to ballpark the cost to maintain one of these? I'm sure it does indeed allow for more power before failure, but I'm not sold on the idea that it'll last more miles or more years.

I probably wouldve avoided the 2.7 had I known this. Everything I read about the 2.7 oil pumps must've been referring to the previous gen.
 

JExpedition07

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Oh I forgot the 3.0 PowerStroke also uses the oil pump belt so there are 3 engines this generation of truck, but the PS was only a 2021 engine.
 
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Gosh I like this place! Tons of new information and knowledgeable folks on here!
 
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Sneezy

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My consideration is not which is superior from a horsepower perspective. I do have the 3.3 after all 😜. My truck is used for my business and I put 60k+ miles a year on my truck. My previous truck (5.4 2v Triton) had 500k miles on it, still on the original timing chain. I’m not saying a belt couldn’t do it, but I would never take that chance on such a vital part that’s soaking in solvents. My bumper to bumper warranty is already up on my six month old truck just from mileage. For me the main consideration when picking engines at the dealership was from the perspective of a fleet buyer i.e which one will get me to that 500k mark with the least amount of potential down time. I’ll be at that 500k mark in about seven years (knock on wood)
 

WhiteLightningnshitshadow

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My consideration is not which is superior from a horsepower perspective. I do have the 3.3 after all 😜. My truck is used for my business and I put 60k+ miles a year on my truck. My previous truck (5.4 2v Triton) had 500k miles on it, still on the original timing chain. I’m not saying a belt couldn’t do it, but I would never take that chance on such a vital part that’s soaking in solvents. My bumper to bumper warranty is already up on my six month old truck just from mileage. For me the main consideration when picking engines at the dealership was from the perspective of a fleet buyer i.e which one will get me to that 500k mark with the least amount of potential down time. I’ll be at that 500k mark in about seven years (knock on wood)
I mean it's pretty universally recognized that the 2wd XL trucks with the 3.3 are most likely to make it the longest.
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