Another "can/should I tow this" thread: EB MaxTow hauling Bobcat

[ANZAC]

I need to do a SINGLE pickup trip, about 800 miles (mostly easy flat interstate except one mountain pass).
I am not in a hurry.

My rig is a 23 EB Lariat SCREW 6.5 MaxTow with XL5 axle so:

GCWR 19400 (from 2023 Ford towing chart)
GVWR 7150 (white door sticker)
Max trailer weight 13800 (from 2023 Ford towing chart)
Max payload 1624 (yellow door sticker)
Max tongue weight on hitch 1400lb (Ford hitch sticker)
Max hitch capacity 14000 lb (Ford hitch sticker)

Trailer is:
10k flat trailer - approx 3000lb, 16ft length, so sway likely not an issue
Bobcat Toolcat 5680lb
Total trailer weight = 8680 lb
15% tongue weight = 1302 lb

I weigh 250lb. So 1302+250= 1552 which is < 1624

My two concerns are:
- how much rear squat the truck has under that load and how the dynamics are (I've never had ANY load in my truck other than camping stuff, which won't be there this trip - so not much experience with

- transmission/temps -- ambient is likely to be < 75 F

So technically I am within all the load limits. Just.

The real question is, how good an idea is this? Will be a one time thing.

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[tsigwing]

Max tongue weight on hitch 1400lb (Ford hitch sticker)

Is that not with a WDH? Thinking without one you will overload the ball/hitch.

 

[madsend81]

Make sure you have a weight distribution hitch. Those payload numbers require one. Consider anti-sway as well. It might be one of those things where you don't know you need it until suddenly you do.
Otherwise, your load is within the specs provided by Ford. For one drive, you should be fine. Use Tow/Haul mode to keep RPM's up and transmission out of overdrive when going up hills and grades.
Take it easy and plan on stopping for the night if you're driving 800 mi.

 

[ANZAC]

Max tongue weight on hitch 1400lb (Ford hitch sticker)

Is that not with a WDH? Thinking without one you will overload the ball/hitch.

(edit) and yes you are correct, the 1400lb tongue weight is WITH a WDH.

No WDH on rental trailer. 1302 (est at 15% of 8680 total trailer weight) < 1400. Just.

Thinking I will make sure the load is over the trailer axles (and just slightly fwd) as much as is reasonable.

My ball/mount is rated at 1800lb tongue, 18000lb load.

 

[ANZAC]

Make sure you have a weight distribution hitch. Those payload numbers require one. Consider anti-sway as well. It might be one of those things where you don't know you need it until suddenly you do.
Otherwise, your load is within the specs provided by Ford. For one drive, you should be fine. Use Tow/Haul mode to keep RPM's up and transmission out of overdrive when going up hills and grades.
Take it easy and plan on stopping for the night if you're driving 800 mi.

No WDH (rental trailer).

I know it is a lot of weight but re anti sway, it is a relatively short trailer. So....?

Was planning use to use tow mode and overnight.

 

[tsigwing]

No WDH on rental trailer. 1302 (est at 15% of 8680 total trailer weight) < 1400. Just.

Thinking I will make sure the load is over the trailer axles (and just slightly fwd) as much as is reasonable.

My ball/mount is rated at 1800lb tongue, 18000lb load.

You must have a different hitch than I do. Mine is rated 500/1160lbs, so I certainly could not tow that trailer without a WDH.

 

[ANZAC]

Alright, here's the piece of information I was missing! It was on page 44 of the 2023 towing guide.
(edit) it is also on the hitch sticker, I guess I need new glasses

Weight carrying up to 5,000 lb, weight distributing hitch 5,000-14,000.

 

[ANZAC]

You must have a different hitch than I do. Mine is rated 500/1160lbs, so I certainly could not tow that trailer without a WDH.

This has the Max Tow package. Includes a "Class IV" (ish) hitch, "3/4 float" rear axle etc.
Hitch is rated for 1400/14000 per sticker, vehicle GCWR is 13,800 (only EB MaxTows get this high in F150s).

But the catch, as I posted above, is that it needs to be weight distributing if above 5,000lb trailer load.

 

[madsend81]

Yep, WDH needed or else your tow rating drops to 5,000 lb. So much for Max Tow if you don't have a WDH.
You can get WDH setups that are not permanently mounted to the trailer. They use u-bolts to clamp the trailer brackets around the frame of the trailer.

 

[UGADawg96]

Or rent a super duty for a couple days.

 

[Jeff1024]

1300lb is a lot of weight on the tongue of a 1/2 Ton Truck with or without weight distribution.

We purchased a boat last year that was not on a custom trailer. Perfect boat just a terrible trailer setup - it was putting about 950lbs on the tongue on the truck. It did not have any provisions for weight distribution.

The F150 handled it fine, but the front end for sure was light and the back was squatting a good 2 - 2.5 inches.

We have since moved a trailer that was custom made for the boat and the new tongue weight is around 350 - 400lb. Same boat, just better balanced on the trailer. The boat is still over 5,000lbs but I dont run a WDH.

At the higher tongue weight the truck pulled it without issues, the hitch didnt snap off the frame, but I wouldn't do it on a regular basis. I also wouldn't want much more than 950lbs on the hitch without Weight Distribution. At 1300lbs you are going to be pretty low in the rear with a lot of weight off the front end.

 

[ANZAC]

At the higher tongue weight the truck pulled it without issues, the hitch didnt snap off the frame, but I wouldn't do it on a regular basis. I also wouldn't want much more than 950lbs on the hitch without Weight Distribution. At 1300lbs you are going to be pretty low in the rear with a lot of weight off the front end.

According to the hitch sticker and the Ford towing guide, anything above 500lb on the tongue requires a WDH. (see above)

I'm going to pick up a WDH because I can also use it on an enclosed car trailer I am planning to buy.

 

[amschind]

1) "A friend" hauled a combine back from Iowa to Texas with way more than 1300# on the hitch without a WDH becuase "my friend" looked on the internet instead of inside the manual that he had found on eBay at a great cost in time and money. So yes, you CAN do it.

2) You 100% should get a WDH and use it. I leave my Equalizer set up on my utility trailer, and it's awesome. It's a a big hunk of steel. I used a chop saw to cut the bottom of my hitch adapter off because I didn't need it to hang down so low, and that process required about 30 minutes. An active effort to destroy the Equalizer using light industrial tools requires time and effort.

 

[Jeff1024]

According to the hitch sticker and the Ford towing guide, anything above 500lb on the tongue requires a WDH. (see above)

Yup, I have read the guide, totally understand that Ford says the weight carrying limit of the hitch on the F150 is 500/5000. But lets step through this logically.

The 500lb weight carrying limit is there to prevent too much weight from being taken off the front wheels while towing. Placing weight on the tongue leverages weight off the steer axle. This results in poor braking and steering performance.

Most towing guides recommend at minimum 10% of the overfall trailer weight should be on the hitch. Limiting the weight carrying capacity to 500lbs and using this guideline means the max trailer weight would be 5,000lbs. Simple math.

Boat Trailers can get away with less tongue weight while maintaining overall stability. 5% - 7% of the overall weight on the tongue is not uncommon. Our boat on the trailer is around 6750 - 7000lbs and has a tongue weight of 350 - 375lbs verified by a tongue weight scale. Tows great had it up to 75mph, no sway, not pulling it any faster than that anytime soon.

The purpose of the WDH is act as a lever to move the weight pushing down on the tongue back to the front axle of the truck and axles of the trailer. The WDH does nothing to help with the lateral forces felt by the hitch while towing.

With or without a WDH while towing our boat the hitch is going to be pulling 6750lbs forward. At only 350lbs pushing down on the hitch I really dont need any weight leveraged back to the front axle of the truck.

So thats why I feel pretty comfortable towing a boat with 350lbs on the tongue that is also over the 5000lb limit without a WDH.

It's not that I think I am smarter than Ford Engineers, its more that I think Ford Engineers simplified the hitch rating as much as possible. They essentially said the most weight the hitch can carry is 500lbs. Trailers average 10% of their overall weight on the hitch. We are not going to account for oddball cases like boats or equipment trailers which hitch weight can vary outside of the 10% Rate it for 500/5000.

 

[ANZAC]

Yup, I have read the guide, totally understand that Ford says the weight carrying limit of the hitch on the F150 is 500/5000. But lets step through this logically.

The 500lb weight carrying limit is there to prevent too much weight from being taken off the front wheels while towing. Placing weight on the tongue leverages weight off the steer axle. This results in poor braking and steering performance.

Most towing guides recommend at minimum 10% of the overfall trailer weight should be on the hitch. Limiting the weight carrying capacity to 500lbs and using this guideline means the max trailer weight would be 5,000lbs. Simple math.

Boat Trailers can get away with less tongue weight while maintaining overall stability. 5% - 7% of the overall weight on the tongue is not uncommon. Our boat on the trailer is around 6750 - 7000lbs and has a tongue weight of 350 - 375lbs verified by a tongue weight scale. Tows great had it up to 75mph, no sway, not pulling it any faster than that anytime soon.

The purpose of the WDH is act as a lever to move the weight pushing down on the tongue back to the front axle of the truck and axles of the trailer. The WDH does nothing to help with the lateral forces felt by the hitch while towing.

With or without a WDH while towing our boat the hitch is going to be pulling 6750lbs forward. At only 350lbs pushing down on the hitch I really dont need any weight leveraged back to the front axle of the truck.

So thats why I feel pretty comfortable towing a boat with 350lbs on the tongue that is also over the 5000lb limit without a WDH.

It's not that I think I am smarter than Ford Engineers, its more that I think Ford Engineers simplified the hitch rating as much as possible. They essentially said the most weight the hitch can carry is 500lbs. Trailers average 10% of their overall weight on the hitch. We are not going to account for oddball cases like boats or equipment trailers which hitch weight can vary outside of the 10% Rate it for 500/5000.

But with < 10% weight on the tongue with the new trailer, doesn't that cause stability issues?

Ie I could move the Bobcat further back on the trailer (still over the axles) and lower the tongue weight, but the guidance always seems to be 10-15% tongue weight. Of course a larger load.

PS I ordered a WDH, 10k Fastway e2.

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