adyaro77
Well-known member
- First Name
- Anthony
- Joined
- Sep 23, 2023
- Threads
- 15
- Messages
- 293
- Reaction score
- 214
- Location
- Clay Township
- Vehicles
- 2023 F-150
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- #1
I figured I would share my build as I found the whole experience extremely beneficial to the type of suspension/build I wanted. It's going to be long, but hopefully for some of you it's beneficial. For others it may piss you off. I can say I have had professionals help this entire build. This post is based on their experience/opinions. These guys grew up wrenching and will admit they don't know squat about forscan, but can weld a frame together and build a suspension from scratch. I'm not saying all the information is 100% accurate, but it's coming from a good source and more importantly for a specific build. For you Max Tow guys maxing out your F-150's this does not apply. Take the info as you will. I'm fortunate to be really good friends with some guys in my opinion are the best of the best at this. For me I'm just a truck enthusiast that can work with my hands. Since this was going to be a truck that carries my family almost daily and a few times a year cross country I wasn't messing around.
Yes my rollover risk has increased.
Coming from construction and primarily driving 3/4 ton pickup trucks I was used used to a better towing and hauling experience. Now that being said I'm not an idiot. I understand why. When I went to purchase my first F-150 I went for more power and max tow. The first thing I noticed with my 6200 lb boat was how it pushed and pulled the truck. This made my wife extremely nervous when towing. For me it wasn't the end of the world, but I did wonder could this be improved.
So one night at a bonfire drinking scotch and smoking cigars I asked my suspension buddy.... Can we make the F-150 tow more comfortably? Are there modifications that can be made for a more comfortable towing experience?
This was never about increasing payload which we all know cannot be done. His response, the F-150 doesn't roll off the line to give you a comfortable towing experience they sell it as a comfortable daily driver that can do some truck stuff on the weekends. In his opinion they should offer a heavy duty version. I couldn't agree more. He continued ...It's simple you can either have one or the other, but not both when you go over your listed 50% towing capacity. In his opinion 5,000 lb is the limit for a comfortable towing experience. Ironically for my truck that's right around 5,000 lb. If you read your label on your hitch after 5,000 lb you need a weight distribution hitch. This is not a coincidence. He added in order to make these kind of modifications you're going to have to have some extra payload as unfortunately you'll lose some.
One of the biggest myths he has heard in his career as a suspension specialist is lifting a truck ruines its towing ability. He stated even though this can be true it sure hell isn't true at 2.5 in. When I asked him how many times he's done this build for his customers he told me he has lost count. He added this build won't ruin your truck and most importantly shouldn't have any warranty issues. As we all know once you start doing these kind of modifications you're on your own with the new parts anyways.
The facts about this build:
1. I want my cake and eat it too. I could easily go back to a Super Duty. I want the best of both worlds. Better gas mileage and more comfortable driving around as a daily. One of the goals because I tow approximately 1200 miles cross country is I wanted not to lose a lot of gas mileage. So far so good even with the new tires as of yesterday. I'm not seeing a big difference at all. Not even one mile per gallon.
2. 24' XLT 302A 5.0 3:73 rear. Payload sticker 1720 lbs. Added tow mirrors, hard trifold cover, and spray in liner. Weight of these items has been pulled from the available payload. We're currently still working on the weight of the added suspension parts with the deduction of the OEM parts. As he has done this build several times he knows that for my application everything will be safe and legal. This is why it was extremely important for me to go back to an XLT. I would have loved the Platinum sitting at the lot in June, but we can't all have what we want.
3. As we needed a firmer ride my buddy said either Icon 2.5' or Bilstein 6112's. Adding I can't go wrong with either brand in this application. As someone who is a huge fan of Fox this was probably my toughest purchase. I called icon customer service to start getting some information. I had a poor customer service experience so they were knocked out immediately. By the way Bilstein customer service is top notch. I decided on the Bilstein 6112 and 5160. I was going to go with the Ford performance kit. The problem is I lifted the rear end of my truck. The rear shocks in that kit only allow for up to one inch. The other issue is they are tuned differently for Ford performance. The 5160s allow for up to 2 in. This info was confirmed by both Ford performance and Bilstein.
4. I picked up Auto Springs third leaf kit. The rating for the Pair is right around 960 lb. Again just for some of you we are not trying to increase payload. The rating is important for the stiffness. As I was going to get the OEM third leafs but as I learned with my first max tow Truck they have a much less rating and we were looking for lift.
5. I wanted the front lifted 2.5 in and whatever rake would be necessary. I am currently at 1.75 and we'll go down to 1.5 with the added half inch of the 6112's. (Currently have auto Springs 2" spacer) will replace OEM block for taller if necessary. This is where the timbrens came in. Now I'm not having the conversation about airbags. I had them and they do not apply in this application. Why? We are adding a third leaf that can handle the load alone without squatting. Leafs alone may not work for your application.
6. Timbrens will be installed in place of the bump stop and set so the truck will sit a little above level at max payload. Does my truck ride rougher? Yes it does. Is it horrible? No, not even close. Nothing like my last Super Duty.
7. Max trailer and boat weight is 6200 lb. Without fuel 400 lb of tongue weight. 500 when full of fuel.
8. I wanted larger tires. I had to stay away from D/E ply. Part of improving a comfortable towing experience was more contact with the road. So I needed a wider tire. But since we didn't want to have a torque issue we didn't want that much more height. We are at 33.5x11.5. Now this can be argued but with the 3:73 rear end I'm okay. My buddy added everybody can argue wether the weight of wheels and tires reducing payload until they're blue in the face, but the reality is the transmission knows what you did
.
The Toyo Open Country 3 are the best of both worlds imo. It's a 285/60/20 tire that only weighs 48 lb. The whole idea is I will change the air pressure depending on what I'm doing with the truck. This is an extremely popular tire that I honestly just learned about. It has fantastic ratings. Great in the snow and I have not noticed any road noise...fyi. Staying away from E ply tires I was able to keep my unsprung weight under 5 lbs. 4.6 to be exact per tire. I could of easily matched the oem weight with lighter wheels. After installing this setup I can't even tell any difference.
I haven't done the calibration on forscan yet. Tires are a half inch wider and a half inch taller. With running a separate GPS in my truck. I set the cruise control between 46-55 miles per hour and my GPS kept switching between dead on and one mile per hour slower. I have an Android and my buddy has an apple. His phone was doing the exact same thing. At some point I'll mess with forscan
9. As far as Wheels I was told to stick with a 20x9. Lighter than oem. The lighter the better. I only went down 3 pounds per wheel. Simply because I'm extremely picky with aftermarket wheels. I was given instructions no negative offset. No lower than +18 offset. I'll be honest here I made a mistake.. I now have a little bit of poke as you'll see in the pictures. It's a little more than we wanted. That's on me. My first F-150 I thought had 285/55/20. l actually had 275/55/20 BFGoodrich ko2. They're a little bit wider of a 275 tire. And well we're now going to add larger mud flaps and fender protection to help the situation. I'm not adding fender flares. He discussed painting the inside part of the wheel well. I'll just have to stay off Rocky roads..lol. I'm going with Rek Gen offset flaps. I'm getting a lot of compliments and I do like the look for sure. I really didn't want to have to worry about shit flying on the sides... So I'm still a little pissed at myself. When I replace these tires I will be going back to 275. Cooper has a wide 275 tire as well fyi.
10. None of the factory bolts will be reused. A camber/ caster kit is not required for this build because we are using the SPC upper control arms. Just to note they're normally not required for f-150s.
10. At this time we're not installing Ford performance/Tremor CV axles. I'm going to wait a little and then I will upgrade. At 2.5 in it's not necessary. Over two and a half they said I would be upgrading during this build.
11. Since we are ripping the front end apart we're going to replace the sway links and some other parts. They were a simple inexpensive upgrade.
10. TPMS sensors. I went with Ford Performance because I wanted a dependable 433 MHz TPMS sensor. Yeah they're not the best looking, but I wanted one that I could just throw on my truck and wouldn't have to mess with. Not saying the aftermarket ones wouldn't work I just wanted to make things easier.
11. More maintenance will be required with special grease. SPC lists the required type. I had to order. My local auto parts store didn't have it. Most replaced parts will not be maintenance free anymore on my truck. This was new to me.
Installed this weekend.
-Toyo open country 3 116T 285/60/20
- KMC Chase 20x9 18mm offset
- Gorilla 2" spline lugs and locks.
- Ford performance TPMS sensors. M-1180-433MHZ
- Bilstein's 5160
- Auto Springs add a leafs
- Tremor stone guards
Being installed in the next couple of weeks.
- Bilstein 6112's at 2.5"
- SPC upper control arms 25685
- Supreme anti-sway links and other front end parts.
- Universal Rek Gen offset mud flaps.
- Timbren FR1504E with spacer kit
Again guys I'm not looking to argue. This is based on a professional's opinion off a build he has done in the past. His customers liked the results. I'm dying to go pick up my boat and drive it around but he wants to complete the build first.
Yes my rollover risk has increased.
Coming from construction and primarily driving 3/4 ton pickup trucks I was used used to a better towing and hauling experience. Now that being said I'm not an idiot. I understand why. When I went to purchase my first F-150 I went for more power and max tow. The first thing I noticed with my 6200 lb boat was how it pushed and pulled the truck. This made my wife extremely nervous when towing. For me it wasn't the end of the world, but I did wonder could this be improved.
So one night at a bonfire drinking scotch and smoking cigars I asked my suspension buddy.... Can we make the F-150 tow more comfortably? Are there modifications that can be made for a more comfortable towing experience?
This was never about increasing payload which we all know cannot be done. His response, the F-150 doesn't roll off the line to give you a comfortable towing experience they sell it as a comfortable daily driver that can do some truck stuff on the weekends. In his opinion they should offer a heavy duty version. I couldn't agree more. He continued ...It's simple you can either have one or the other, but not both when you go over your listed 50% towing capacity. In his opinion 5,000 lb is the limit for a comfortable towing experience. Ironically for my truck that's right around 5,000 lb. If you read your label on your hitch after 5,000 lb you need a weight distribution hitch. This is not a coincidence. He added in order to make these kind of modifications you're going to have to have some extra payload as unfortunately you'll lose some.
One of the biggest myths he has heard in his career as a suspension specialist is lifting a truck ruines its towing ability. He stated even though this can be true it sure hell isn't true at 2.5 in. When I asked him how many times he's done this build for his customers he told me he has lost count. He added this build won't ruin your truck and most importantly shouldn't have any warranty issues. As we all know once you start doing these kind of modifications you're on your own with the new parts anyways.
The facts about this build:
1. I want my cake and eat it too. I could easily go back to a Super Duty. I want the best of both worlds. Better gas mileage and more comfortable driving around as a daily. One of the goals because I tow approximately 1200 miles cross country is I wanted not to lose a lot of gas mileage. So far so good even with the new tires as of yesterday. I'm not seeing a big difference at all. Not even one mile per gallon.
2. 24' XLT 302A 5.0 3:73 rear. Payload sticker 1720 lbs. Added tow mirrors, hard trifold cover, and spray in liner. Weight of these items has been pulled from the available payload. We're currently still working on the weight of the added suspension parts with the deduction of the OEM parts. As he has done this build several times he knows that for my application everything will be safe and legal. This is why it was extremely important for me to go back to an XLT. I would have loved the Platinum sitting at the lot in June, but we can't all have what we want.
3. As we needed a firmer ride my buddy said either Icon 2.5' or Bilstein 6112's. Adding I can't go wrong with either brand in this application. As someone who is a huge fan of Fox this was probably my toughest purchase. I called icon customer service to start getting some information. I had a poor customer service experience so they were knocked out immediately. By the way Bilstein customer service is top notch. I decided on the Bilstein 6112 and 5160. I was going to go with the Ford performance kit. The problem is I lifted the rear end of my truck. The rear shocks in that kit only allow for up to one inch. The other issue is they are tuned differently for Ford performance. The 5160s allow for up to 2 in. This info was confirmed by both Ford performance and Bilstein.
4. I picked up Auto Springs third leaf kit. The rating for the Pair is right around 960 lb. Again just for some of you we are not trying to increase payload. The rating is important for the stiffness. As I was going to get the OEM third leafs but as I learned with my first max tow Truck they have a much less rating and we were looking for lift.
5. I wanted the front lifted 2.5 in and whatever rake would be necessary. I am currently at 1.75 and we'll go down to 1.5 with the added half inch of the 6112's. (Currently have auto Springs 2" spacer) will replace OEM block for taller if necessary. This is where the timbrens came in. Now I'm not having the conversation about airbags. I had them and they do not apply in this application. Why? We are adding a third leaf that can handle the load alone without squatting. Leafs alone may not work for your application.
6. Timbrens will be installed in place of the bump stop and set so the truck will sit a little above level at max payload. Does my truck ride rougher? Yes it does. Is it horrible? No, not even close. Nothing like my last Super Duty.
7. Max trailer and boat weight is 6200 lb. Without fuel 400 lb of tongue weight. 500 when full of fuel.
8. I wanted larger tires. I had to stay away from D/E ply. Part of improving a comfortable towing experience was more contact with the road. So I needed a wider tire. But since we didn't want to have a torque issue we didn't want that much more height. We are at 33.5x11.5. Now this can be argued but with the 3:73 rear end I'm okay. My buddy added everybody can argue wether the weight of wheels and tires reducing payload until they're blue in the face, but the reality is the transmission knows what you did
.The Toyo Open Country 3 are the best of both worlds imo. It's a 285/60/20 tire that only weighs 48 lb. The whole idea is I will change the air pressure depending on what I'm doing with the truck. This is an extremely popular tire that I honestly just learned about. It has fantastic ratings. Great in the snow and I have not noticed any road noise...fyi. Staying away from E ply tires I was able to keep my unsprung weight under 5 lbs. 4.6 to be exact per tire. I could of easily matched the oem weight with lighter wheels. After installing this setup I can't even tell any difference.
I haven't done the calibration on forscan yet. Tires are a half inch wider and a half inch taller. With running a separate GPS in my truck. I set the cruise control between 46-55 miles per hour and my GPS kept switching between dead on and one mile per hour slower. I have an Android and my buddy has an apple. His phone was doing the exact same thing. At some point I'll mess with forscan
9. As far as Wheels I was told to stick with a 20x9. Lighter than oem. The lighter the better. I only went down 3 pounds per wheel. Simply because I'm extremely picky with aftermarket wheels. I was given instructions no negative offset. No lower than +18 offset. I'll be honest here I made a mistake.. I now have a little bit of poke as you'll see in the pictures. It's a little more than we wanted. That's on me. My first F-150 I thought had 285/55/20. l actually had 275/55/20 BFGoodrich ko2. They're a little bit wider of a 275 tire. And well we're now going to add larger mud flaps and fender protection to help the situation. I'm not adding fender flares. He discussed painting the inside part of the wheel well. I'll just have to stay off Rocky roads..lol. I'm going with Rek Gen offset flaps. I'm getting a lot of compliments and I do like the look for sure. I really didn't want to have to worry about shit flying on the sides... So I'm still a little pissed at myself. When I replace these tires I will be going back to 275. Cooper has a wide 275 tire as well fyi.
10. None of the factory bolts will be reused. A camber/ caster kit is not required for this build because we are using the SPC upper control arms. Just to note they're normally not required for f-150s.
10. At this time we're not installing Ford performance/Tremor CV axles. I'm going to wait a little and then I will upgrade. At 2.5 in it's not necessary. Over two and a half they said I would be upgrading during this build.
11. Since we are ripping the front end apart we're going to replace the sway links and some other parts. They were a simple inexpensive upgrade.
10. TPMS sensors. I went with Ford Performance because I wanted a dependable 433 MHz TPMS sensor. Yeah they're not the best looking, but I wanted one that I could just throw on my truck and wouldn't have to mess with. Not saying the aftermarket ones wouldn't work I just wanted to make things easier.
11. More maintenance will be required with special grease. SPC lists the required type. I had to order. My local auto parts store didn't have it. Most replaced parts will not be maintenance free anymore on my truck. This was new to me.
Installed this weekend.
-Toyo open country 3 116T 285/60/20
- KMC Chase 20x9 18mm offset
- Gorilla 2" spline lugs and locks.
- Ford performance TPMS sensors. M-1180-433MHZ
- Bilstein's 5160
- Auto Springs add a leafs
- Tremor stone guards
Being installed in the next couple of weeks.
- Bilstein 6112's at 2.5"
- SPC upper control arms 25685
- Supreme anti-sway links and other front end parts.
- Universal Rek Gen offset mud flaps.
- Timbren FR1504E with spacer kit
Again guys I'm not looking to argue. This is based on a professional's opinion off a build he has done in the past. His customers liked the results. I'm dying to go pick up my boat and drive it around but he wants to complete the build first.
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